Question Auditory behavior idle and under load: decibels and noise

@jlankford   Ouch.   Good point about not making assumptions about different units.  Thanks, I will look into the 18K / 6K thing.

I will see if I can find the fan dB rating for the 3000EHV. However, here is the fan control logic for the 6000XP and 18kPV:

6000XP Fan Control Logic:

• Left and Middle Fans: Activate when charging or discharging power exceeds 300W.
• Right Fan: Activates when PV power exceeds 300W or load consumption surpasses 5000W.

18KPV Fan Control Logic:

• Fans activate once the inverter consumption exceeds 6000W.

@jared WOW, that's fantastic information, just what I needed.

I have eight (8) X 540W solar panels in a string, so production much of the day is likely to be 2000-3000W and maybe a bit more.

Even sunrise and sunset would be > 300W, which means the fans would run constantly in the daytime, which is radically unacceptable.

Where did you get the info?  Now I am wondering about the 12000XP since the 18KPV is a $5000 inverter, whose price kills the ROI.

@jared To clarify on "Left and Middle Fans: Activate when charging or discharging power exceeds 300W", does that mean PV power input also?  In other words, all 3 fans on when PV power exceeds 300W?

Up to what PV charging input could the 12kPV maintain silence?

My steady state load is 200-300W.   I want silence for that, and for PV charging.  Silence up to 800 kW load would be a big plus.

What happens if I put a load over 1 kW does not concern me much since that would be a big noisy item anyway.

(that last comment should read "800W" not 800 kW!)

My worst case steady state load is about 700W, for which silence would be a huge plus.

The string of eight (8) X 540W solar panels I suppose could get close to 4000W in peak conditions in summer.

What about auditory behavior of 12kVP vs 12000XP?

Posted by: @diglloyd

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To clarify on "Left and Middle Fans: Activate when charging or discharging power exceeds 300W", does that mean PV power input also?  In other words, all 3 fans on when PV power exceeds 300W?

For the 18Kpv the fan logic appears to trigger just based on power flow through the unit, in any permutation... into or out of the battery. Simple grid to load pass-through doesn't trigger it. I imagine the other models' logic is the same for their respective power trigger points. Note that the fan logic is immediate and not tied to temperature - fans will come on the moment the power level is reached when the unit is still cold. I expect there is some temperature logic to keep the fans running longer for cooldown after the power drops.

@jlankford Thank you.  Does the 12000XP  and/or 12kPV operate on similar logic?

I'm not willing to tolerate 50 dB of noise all day long from PV input—I can hear that 100 feet away.

Posted by: @diglloyd

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@jlankford Thank you.  Does the 12000XP  and/or 12kPV operate on similar logic?

I'm not willing to tolerate 50 dB of noise all day long from PV input—I can hear that 100 feet away.

I have no idea about the other models. I agree with you about the noise. It's the reason I bought a hybrid inverter, so I could mount it outdoors. Other than that, I had no need for the hybrid.

@jared @jlankford   thx.  How does the hybrid address the issue eg 12kPV vs 12000XP ?

As far as "outdoors" that is in fact my concern... weather is good here all year, I have a nice yard and even a 35 dB background noise on nice days is unacceptable since I could hear it 100 feet away in my yard.  We also leave windows open 300 days a year or so, so any noise intrudes inside as well.

Worse, the garage where inverter would go abuts a breezeway (open air roofed area) that we enjoy frequently.

Any noise at all degrades quality of life, which is a non-starter.

For this to work at all, the thing has to be silent even with 4K of PV load. Or at least not noisy for more than one hour a day at peak. I know people put up with that, but not me, I physically cannot tolerate such things (readers should try having a brain injury if this seems unreasonable).

Maybe it is not possible and I just bought $1400 of big solar panels I can't use, lest I degrade quality of life.

Alternately, maybe I will be forced into a really expensive inverter, if in fact the 18kPV and/or 12kPV are silent with 4K of PV input. It degrades the ROI, but my ROI is -100% if I give up on the panels entirely.

It is the job of EG4 to weigh in here on their own products!

Note that the 12kPV is noticeably cheaper than the 18kPV and has a lower idle power consumption, so a win on both counts if you don't need the full power of the 18kPV.

@diglloyd I appreciate your questions about the sound decibels through this thread. It's helpful cuz I'm dealing with a very similar issues.

In the obsessive research I've been doing over the past week, I came across a video (in the video sections of this site) of the 14k indoor battery. It also makes quite a loud fan sound 😬 to the point that I would invest in the outdoor battery model as well. Even though I still think it'll be annoyingly loud in the Summer with the windows open like you're saying. My project is a tiny home/food concession trailer. But I think I would get used to it. 

I could be wrong and it might have been the inverter making the sound, but I think he specifically said that was the fan of that eg4 battery and the fan is pretty much on well the thing is charging or in use.

At this point I'm unsure what kind of inverter. But I'm thinking the chargeverter (just to charge the battery by AC plug at night and then use the battery in the day) or the 3000 watt (for inside, but I'm not wanting the sound either), so may I have to look at the outdoor 12 or 18K inverters, but it's overkill (when I only need 3,000 output Max, but 10 to 15 kilowatt hours per day).

Having to get such a oversized inverter and price included is stopping me from buying eg system products entirely. It would be nice if they came out with an outdoor inverter/charger that was 3000-5000 Watts. I feel like there'd be so many applications for it other than you and me. Anyone with a barn, anyone with a garage, anyone with a workshop.... Even if I had it for my house I wouldn't need that big. Some of us live small 😅

I'm moving on to see if other brands make outdoor small hybrid inverters.

If anyone gets this far and reads this and has any suggestions I am open to anything 🙏

(There's not enough AC power from my 1 ouside outlet to power the trailer on its own and no room on the electrical panel, that's why I need the battery pack with a 3000 to 5000 watt inverter. To use 2,800 Watts continuously for 5 to 8 hours... Making chocolate)

@laurjam Interesting comments, thank you.

I didn’t realize that the battery had fans also.  That might not be correct? After all, the rack batteries are just batteries with cables attached.   But if true, that's  a bad combo because two sets of fans can interact and create an oscillating highly irritating noise pattern—essentially sounds waves overlapping and creating a choppy surface. It might not be annoying, but it might be very annoying.

I can't believe that customers out there are willing to put up with noise. Also, outdoors is actually a worse case if one enjoys a backyard in moderate temps (most of the year where I live!). So outdoor is worse, not better, for me.

"Quiet fans" are largely an oxymoro—if you can hear it, then it's intruding and having an impact. Noise is actually much more than irritating; noise is a health hazard that degrades learning and cognitive function. I would rather forget about solar panels than put up with constant noise.

There seems to be no way to experience the various products. Could easily spend $7K and then find the noise is intolerable.  Dunno about you, but that's not a risk I want to take, so I have to find credible information on it.

My guess is that EG4 units are among the best available for noise. And that the larger units like the 12000XP, 12kPV are much quieter than the 6000XP or smaller.  

It sure would be nice if EG4 could speak to their own products.  I sent an email, but no response so far.

@diglloyd 

I was thinking that if we get nowhere with the research products available, it is possible to potentially build a soundproof/reducing box around it, with enough space for heat dissipation and everything.

The sounds might not bother people because they're potentially on off-grid outbuildings or using it for house backup or it's on their garage wall outside far from the public areas. It seems we're dealing with tighter spaces, though I recognize the sound would bother you 100 yards away (and of course health conditions that are easily over stimulated) Inside my trailer is only 15x7 so my chocolate machine is going to bother me enough even with earplugs. And then I was thinking if I'm in the trailer and the fans are happening outside the trailer, I'm not going to be outside to have it bother me.. BUT! It will because it makes those sounds when charging after 'work' in the evening.

@jared of EG4 could you please research the noise levels of 12000XP, 12kPV for us?  Many thanks.